Here at Batting Border, we are very good at starting a series and have we got another dandy for you. While it's always a risk whether we finish it or not, this is less of a series and more of the base argument among sports teams: How does my team compare to yours? Year after year, people spend hours arguing all the reasons their team is better than someone else's. Minnesota and Wisconsin have seen their fair share of these arguments, and we wouldn't be doing due diligence if we didn't examine some of these comparisons. Rather than poring over every season of Minnesota and Wisconsin sports teams, we would instead like to focus on our own native athletes and the careers they've carved out for themselves. There is much more pride in seeing an athlete from your home city competing at a high level, especially when it's so rare with our Midwestern states. Here, we'd like to examine at each of the four major sports and make teams of players born in Minnesota and Wisconsin. Then, Jon and either James or Sam will argue on why our state has the better collection of players.
Arguing for Minnesota: Jon Gamble
Arguing for Wisconsin: Sam Lisak
Judge, Jury, and executioner: James Schaser (you might think I am biased for Wisconsin but Sam scorned me by not putting Sam Dekker aka The Prince of Sheboygan aka the Malibu of the Midwest on the team)
SL: Do we even need to make points here or is the answer to obvious that everyone reading will just understand who wins in this situation?
JG: Well, it’s obviously Minnesota, but we can explain why I suppose
SL: Minnesota would kill in the 1950s.
JG: You’re not wrong. Even if they wouldn’t ball out in the 2010’s, with this list of categories that James has provided, I like our chances.
SL: James did provide a list that may or may not pertain to actual basketball but will be enjoyable to go through.
JG: Let’s get started. Here are the rosters we have drafted.
MN Roster
PF/C Kevin McHale- 6’10”, 210 lbs
PF Kris Humphries- 6’9”, 235 lbs
C Dan Anderson- 6’10”, 230 lbs
C Joel Przybilla- 7’1”, 255 lbs
PF/C Jon Leuer- 6’10”, 228 lbs
PG Tyus Jones- 6’0”, 196 lbs
PF/C Mike Muscala- 6’10”, 240 lbs
SG Rashad Vaughn- 6’6”, 202 lbs
SG Whitey Skoog- 5’11”, 180 lbs
PG Nate Wolters- 6’4”, 190 lbs
WI Roster
PG/SG Devin Harris- 6’3”, 185 lbs
SG/SF Latrell Sprewell- 6’5”, 190 lbs
SG/SF Caron Butler- 6’7”, 228 lbs
PG/SG Nick Van Exel- 6’1”, 170 lbs
PG/SG Fred Brown- 6’3”, 182 lbs
PG Terry Porter- 6’3”, 195 lbs
PF Carl Landry- 6’9”, 248 lbs
PF/C Kevon Looney- 6’9”, 220 lbs
PF/C Jim Chones- 6’11”, 220 lbs
SG Tyler Herro- 6’5”, 200 lbs
SL: Any Wisconsin fan who thinks Sam Dekker belongs here I would kindly ask you to throw out your entire computer.
JG: This may be the only thing Sam and I agree on in the entire article ^^
JS: I will never forgive you for your heresy
CATEGORY 1: In a Street Fight, which team comes out on top?
SL: Latrell Sprewell is my ace in the corner on this one. He paradoxically does and does not choke under pressure.
JG: While Latrell does give a little edge to the Wisconsin squad, let’s be real. He choked out a 6’1”, skinny, old man from Scranton, PA. Take a look at the size advantage on Minnesota’s side. We’re giants.
SL: Minnesota has the size, sure, but Wisconsin has the fight, Sprewell is still crazy, Landry was undersized and pounded the glass every game, Butler survived a Wizards mid 2000s locker room, our guys are gritty.
JG: Counterpoint: the game was much tougher in pre-1990’s, where many of Minnesota’s players would have thrived. Check out the 6th-largest guy on the team pulling a crazy move on the Lakers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7r6vXeOfyQ
SL: Yes, because in every street fight a clothesline is a move you pull on someone who is ready to go to war. I’m taking the coach-choker all day.
James’ Decision: While Jon has a point that basketball pre-1990’s was tougher, that really just means the players were less restrained. If you had the lax rules they had, other players from different eras would have been just as brutal. Zaza Pachulia would be a 3x DPOY if he was allowed to punch people instead of sneakily undercutting their feet when they shoot a three. Also I just looked at a picture of Whitey Skoog. MN 2 WI 3
CATEGORY 2: Which team is the most marketable/likeable?
SL: This is where Latrell hurts us.
JG: Minnesota’s roster is marketable to Minnesotans and Minnesotans only. But it works for that demographic. We’ve got former Gopher greats McHale and Whitey Skoog, as well as Badger-killer Tyus Jones.
SL: For Wisconsin I take this in two parts. We are definitely not the more likable, that just probably isn’t the case here unless you weirdly enjoy men who choke coaches, but we can definitely be the more marketable. The Wisconsin ball players here are a million times more exciting to watch. I’m already falling asleep imagining a game where Minnesota is forced to run a Tyus Jones/Kevin McHale pick n roll the entire game.
JG: You don’t like watching endless post play? Must not be a Badgers fan.
SL: Spot the lie. Also on the contrary, Nick Van Exel has an electric mixtape everyone should try to check out.
JS: Ethan Happ Footwork video. Screw you guys
James’ Decision: This one really is a wash, on one hand, MN is boring, on the other, WI has Latrell. I'll give Jon the slight edge here because Kevin McHale. MN 3 WI 2
CATEGORY 3: Which team is better without a three-point line, back in the 1960’s?
JG: Need we even debate this?
SL: I mean no one besides Herro on Wisconsin is really that good a three-point shooter, a lot of them carved out nice careers in the physical 90s when 3’s weren’t as popular. I would also like to know the lane dimensions for this era, are they smaller?
JG: Lane would be 12 feet wide, rather than 16. Who is stopping Kevin McHale? He had every move known to man in the post.
SL: I think a swarming committee could still take on McHale just fine although I am more worried by the smaller lanes. I still think our guards could put some pressure. Gotta get the ball up the floor first.
JG: Minnesota has Tyus deny Herro the ball, and all those slashers are going to have an awfully hard time scoring at the rim, especially with the more lenient reffing of that era.
SL: Caron Butler will be fine against whoever was guarding him. Guy used to be a drug dealer when he was 11 in Racine and ended up carving out a nice career scoring from mid-range.
JG: Unfortunately, drugs don’t make you taller. I can rest easy with the size on the Minnesota squad.
SL: Unfortunately, being tall doesn’t make you good. My gritty guys will still get buckets.
James’ Decision: This one was pretty easy. Jon has the best player with McHale, Sam has the next 7 best players who are not reliant on a three. MN 1 WI 4
CATEGORY 4: You can add an “Honorary” (someone not born there but whose essence just screams it) Minnesotan/Wisconsinite, who do you add?
SL: I think you know who each of us are picking, pretty easy choices here. We’re taking Giannis, our adopted giant Greek Wisconsinite. Superstar talent and he addresses a weakness for us.
JG: Yeah, I’d say adding a 7’0” guard who is having one of the best seasons ever addresses a weakness for you. Who do you have me picking?
SL: Initially I thought KAT but then I remembered the Big Ticket, guy gave his heart and soul to Minnesota and gave them some of their best seasons.
JG: I was torn in two directions here. Kevin Garnett (sneakily a Giannis prototype) gave 110% to the team for many years, and carried them to their highest highs. Interestingly, the all-time great who seems more Minnesotan to me is Garnett’s noted rival, the Big Fundamental. The quiet giant, Tim Duncan, went about his business quietly, and was passive-aggressive towards referees. Very Minnesotan. I’ll take Garnett in the end, as he can handle some of the wing duties, which we’re short on.
SL: Garnett could probably verbally abuse Rashad Vaughn into not being a complete liability.
JG: Yeah, because that worked with Jimmy Butler and Andrew Wiggins.
SL: Kevin has more pedigree, I’ll be optimistic here and say it works or Rashad Vaughn is too scared to play and gets benched for Nate Wolters.
James’ Decision: I love KG, I love Giannis, do not make me choose. MN 2.5 WI 2.5
CATEGORY 5: Which team has the best chemistry?
JG: Latrell Sprewell, huge chemistry guy.
SL: If our coach is someone really awful it could work, they all make passive-aggressive comments, then he takes action and leads a coup only to become player-coach. No, but realistically this Wisconsin team was not built for chemistry. I don’t think they would have bad chemistry like we’ve seen with some teams in the past, but they’re not gaining anything extra from that camaraderie.
JG: I have no real concerns about the players on Minnesota’s team getting along off the court. However, the on-court fit/chemistry definitely tips in Wisconsin’s favor, mostly due to Minnesota only producing little guards and centers.
SL: Yes, we are more well-rounded; there were a few decent Wisconsin bigs that didn’t make the team mostly because I couldn’t justify putting Chris Mihm ahead of Tyler Herro. Our on-court fit is more balanced.
JG: I could just see Kevin McHale and Joel Przybilla and Nate Wolters and Jon Leuer and Whitey Skoog sitting around, throwing back some Hamm’s, and talking about their lawn-mowing exploits. Great off-court chemistry. Big Dad Energy.
James’ Decision: I have never wanted to attend a BBQ more. Jon just sold me hard (But Sam does have a better on-court team). MN 3 WI 2
CATEGORY 6: Who has the best name?
SL: Overall my team has better names. Kevon (pronounced Keh-Vaughn) Looney, Tyler Herro (spawns so many good puns), Latrell Sprewell (-ell rhyming?!?!), and the not cult-leading, flavor aid drinking Jim Chones.
JG: The reason Sam goes straight to “overall”, is that while he may have an army, Minnesota has a hulk. Ladies and gentleman, I present to you, Whitey Skoog. Is there a name that screams “50’s basketball star from Minnesota” more?
SL: I mean the name does fit with Minnesota’s team perfectly.
JG: It does. Even the “Skoog” part just seems very Minnesotan. Whitey Skoog should actually be a character in “Fargo”.
SL: A skoog sounds like something you’d need at a lake. Is his real name Whitey?
JG: His birth name was Myer Upton Skoog, evidently. However, he was known exclusively as Whitey at least from college and beyond.
SL: Myer Upton Skoog might be better than Whitey; but who cares, drink our kool aid and come on down to Chonestown.
JG: The question states “Who has the best name”
SL: The wording is up to the court’s interpretation, my closing statement: Quantity over quality.
JG: Classic Miller mentality.
James’ Decision: Sam is appealing to my many hours spent learning about cult leaders (don’t worry about it) however Whitey Skoog appeals to my love of names that sound like a fat baseball reliever from the 1920’s who smoked a pack a game and ate a steak every 7th inning stretch. MN 3 WI 2
CATEGORY 7: Which team wins a basketball game versus the other in 2020?
SL: I mean, there’s no way Wisconsin loses this game.
JG: I submit that Wisconsin could possibly lose, but they absolutely should win 9 out of 10 times. There’s always the possibility that they pull a Rockets and go 0-27 from three. Because they will be taking threes when they see what the paint looks like.
SL: Potentially, but I don’t think these guys shot a lot of threes and these guys won’t be scared of your Dan Andersons. Just for consideration, what is your starting lineup?
JG: Dan Anderson. Sneaky good numbers, don’t hate. My starters would be McHale at the 4, Przybilla at the 5, Tyus at the 1, Mike Muscala at the 3, and Rashad Vaughn at the 2. That gives us our best chance at matching up on defense while still pressing our size advantage. Muscala is also a sneaky-good shooter.
SL: I’d start Porter at 1, Brown at 2, Butler at 3, Landry 4, Chones 5. We can replace Landry or Chones with Sprewell if we wanna downsize. Put the pressure on and then bring in Devin Harris and Nick Van Exel, who just keep running as much as they can, especially with Sprewell. We plug Herro in where needed to space the floor. Looney comes in to bang down low whenever Landry or Chones need a break.
JG: I’m confident that Tyus’s ability to take care of the ball will allow Minnesota to slow the game down. If you aren’t spacing the floor effectively, going small is a disadvantage.
SL: Tyus is normally fine, but against an onslaught of three great and bigger point guards, he’s gonna be needing oxygen at the end. I’m daring Vaughn to beat us and I still think my guys are good enough finishing at the rim and athletic enough that height won’t be an issue for them.
JG: You can see right now with the Bucks what the effect of having, essentially, three 7-footers on the floor does. Granted, none of Minnesota’s can move like Giannis, but if they aren’t going to have to worry about a three-point barrage, none of them need to.
SL: None of them are also Brook Lopez, plus the Bucks also have Bledsoe, Middleton, and Matthews or DiVincenzo applying great pressure at the top but that’s a whole different discussion for another time. Rashad Vaughn is basically a turnstile out there.
James’ Decision: I respect Jon for trying, but no way is Wisconsin losing to Rashad Vaughn. MN 1 WI 4 (The only reason this is not 5-0 is because I want it to look closer) [Editor's note: 5-0 is ludicrous to suggest]
Final Tally: MN 15.5 WI 19.5
Who got it right? Did James's bias show up in the scoring? Drop your opinions in the comments!
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